COD4 Players!

[Gabb]

ITS A GRENADE LAUNCHER. Its supposed to be very powerful. The whole purpose of a grenade is to be able to take out multiple enemies when they are in a close area. A real grenade is more powerful than it is in cod4, and the actual m203 has more range than shown in the game as well.
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A real grenade is more powerful in real life then in COD4? I would actually disagree with you there, as myth busters proved meat shields can actually supress a frag grenades explosion but in COD4 a single grenade can kill 10 people bunched up and prone on top of it point is...don't use realism as a defense, game balance is everything in video games

First of all, i was saying all of this to explain the whole Americas Army thing. And second, you dont need to question who i am:

http://www.techist.com/forums/1378815-post246.html

http://www.techist.com/forums/1344998-post42.html

If you wanna see more pics, i have plenty more. Everyone on this forums who knows me knows who i am, been enlisted for three years now.
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Good for you I'm proud you are defending our country, I really mean it ( no sarcasm ). However my statement #2 states I wasn't doubting who you were, rather just making a comment on how a great deal of forum people in general ( not this forum in particular, other video game and computer forums ) there seems to be a great deal of people who claim to be in the military.

Again, it has nothing to do with "noobs" dying because they dont bunny hop over a dead body. Its a retarted perk that should have never been put into the game.
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But why is it retarded? Once your aware of the actual perk, just don't run over dead bodies and your at an advantage cause their 3rd perk is wasted. If it was allowed in league play no one would even select marty. I view the perk as an issue "noobs" have with, because they keep making the same mistakes and getting killed by marty.

Guess what? The weapon is the same way in real life. So because a pro cant dodge it, it shouldint be in the game. Thats total bs. Games are not made for only "pros" to play. The fact of the matter is that, a grenade has a wide killing radius, and in fact is made to take out multiple enemies in an enclosed area.


The kill radius of an m67 hand grenade is 5-15 meters, and most guys can throw it 40 meters. The range of the m203 is 350 meters, but its pretty much the same grenade as the m67, just in a 40mm cartridge.
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Read my comment up there about game balance > realism in terms of importance. Anyways if you do want to discuss realism, I'm pretty darn sure its exponentially harder to hit a target long range with a m203 then it is in this game ( all factors considered, its ridiculously easy to GL kill in this game, even a 10 year old could do it ).

No, its not unvalid.

You keep referring to "hardcore players" and league play.

At the end of the day, it doesnt take much skill to sit in front of a computer and click a mouse and get kills. You wanna talk to me about skill? Lets go out on the range and put up some targets, and so some real shooting. I bet half the "hardcore players' wont hit a single thing.

Ah now comes out your true beliefs So basically your saying that you don't think a video game doesn't take any skill and many people actually do have this belief ( typically these people are the ones who arent good at video games for some reason ) Anyways I have to strongly disagree with you in terms of that, I do believe video games take a great deal of skill, I won't argue with the whole video games vs real sports, but its undeniable being the best at video games takes a tremendous amounts of skills. They wouldn't have million dollar WCG tournaments in korea if anyone could do it. Being good at video games ( Im talking league good not pub good ) takes a tremendous amount of spatial ability ( your minds abilities to manipulate virtual objects ) and hand eye coordination. Theres a whole e-sports movement thing going on and since the video game industry is becoming bigger and bigger, so is E-sports competitions. Some people think the entire thing is just silly and only nerds put so much time into video games...but anyone has a right to their opinion

and yes I do hold a league/pro players opinion over that of a pub players opinion because obviously they have a tremendous amount more experience. If held them at equal opinions well then...thats like saying my friend who plays basketball every weekend knows as much about the game as Kobe Bryan...ridiculous

 

[~Tofu~]

My usual

P90-RDS
Desert eagle
Clay more
Double Tap
Last stand

MP5-RDS
Desert eagle
Clay more
Stopping power
last stand

AK74-Silencer
desert eagle
C4
Stopping power
Deep impact

Note:-i think martyrdom is only good with shot guns cause this is like the only Super Rush gun where you charge in and die and drop a nade before they know it x]
- for some reason sniping is so hard in this game compared to others, for example the halo series it was much easier, css easy, and say bf2 hard but at least you can land shots.
-LOL last question has anyone beaten the last level on campaign (the air plane one) on extreme or whatever it was called? if so what was your best record of time?

 

[Poizen22]

rican video games do take skill but in diferent places, you syaign it doesnt take skill to play a game is liek sayinghey those soccer players have no skill i can kick a ball to, or artists are all a joke i can do that. everythign takes skill, but in diferent forms, other wise everyone would be equaly good @ everything.

also i think im going to make my most valid argument on the hole gl in cod4 in real life you dotn spawn back with 3 more shots, you run out of shots you either pick them up borrow from soem one ro go back to base. so teh fact that some one can kill 3 people die kill 3 more then die again gives them an infinate ammount of ammo, i guesse that is really the biggest imbalance is the fact you preaty much have infinite ammo. @ that rate you can have a 3 to 1 kill ratio, if not more. like sports it is a game that needs balance, yea sure we can use steroroids btu are they aloud in the olympics nope. the point of the game is to give the most enjoyable experience it can, and tohave everyone run around in multi player shooting gl, isnt fun.

 

[zmatt]

Man your typing is getting worse dude. Please spell check before you post.

I think what Rican is saying, is that if the "hardcore" gamers actually tried to do the things they do in the game in real life then they would fail miserably. And yes things in real life are harder than they are in video games. It takes years of training to become a great marksman. Using a mouse in a video game negates many of the factors that make it difficult. Sure games are Hard. But how long does it take you to learn how to shoot well in a game? Besides there is far more to being a soldier then just knowing how to kill people. Games tend to forget that and give a very 1 dimensional view of things.

 

[NightSurge]

I could easily compete in pro/league play, but I don't have the time, nor a PC. I could compete on 360, but still no time. My life has grown up and I have to keep my gaming to public. It's no wonder that I am always the top player when playing by myself, or that my team always wins when me and a few buddies join up.

I'm not saying it takes no skill, but really, it just takes time. If my friends and I had the time to sit around naming locations on every map and practicing different rush, defense, assault, stealth, and other maneuvers, we could easily compete in pro leagues with the skill set we already have.

 

[Gabb]

Man your typing is getting worse dude. Please spell check before you post.

I think what Rican is saying, is that if the "hardcore" gamers actually tried to do the things they do in the game in real life then they would fail miserably. And yes things in real life are harder than they are in video games. It takes years of training to become a great marksman. Using a mouse in a video game negates many of the factors that make it difficult. Sure games are Hard. But how long does it take you to learn how to shoot well in a game? Besides there is far more to being a soldier then just knowing how to kill people. Games tend to forget that and give a very 1 dimensional view of things.

Hmm….but couldn't I just say that applies vice versa as well, no disrespect to the men and women who are defending our country ( hats off to them ) but if they haven't ever played an FPS game, I doubt they can kill me 1 out of every 100 times I kill them in most FPS games.

Everything is really relative when you think about it Zmatt, look at things this way, yes it takes years of training to become a great marksman but define the term “great marksmen”. Is the definition your ability to compete with the best in the world perhaps? Well then the same applies to gaming as well then. If you want to compete with the best pro gamers, believe it or not, it would it take years and years of constant training ( in a game like Starcraft for example where Korea has training regiments where your considered past your prime once your past the age of 24 due to reflexes ) but some people I'm very sorry to say will never be able to compete against the best in the world, which also brings the debate about natural aptitude in ( I don't want to discuss it, some believe in it, and some don't ). Games like Starcraft and Counterstrike aren't super Mario brothers 1, they have so many depths of strategy that people are STILL coming up with tactics and team work techniques.

You guys should learn to respect and recognize the dedication some people have put into games. Sure they aren't saving the world or defending our country but that doesn't mean they should be looked down upon, they are merely doing what brings them entertainment, which is really what the primary of life is about. If you've never seen any pro gaming competition videos ( I severely doubt some of you have ), well then you have no idea exactly how MUCH better pro gamers are in their games then casual or even very good players. Heck I remember watching the CS videos back in the day of Ksharp and I could SWEAR by his view he was using aimbot…but he wasn't because he played in person in a CPL event…that's how good he was…it was just simply amazing…

Oh and a side note is many armies are starting to use FPS games to teach people basic infantry tactics and team work coordination see games aren't useless hehe

I could easily compete in pro/league play, but I don't have the time, nor a PC. I could compete on 360, but still no time. My life has grown up and I have to keep my gaming to public. It's no wonder that I am always the top player when playing by myself, or that my team always wins when me and a few buddies join up.

I'm not saying it takes no skill, but really, it just takes time. If my friends and I had the time to sit around naming locations on every map and practicing different rush, defense, assault, stealth, and other maneuvers, we could easily compete in pro leagues with the skill set we already have.

No offense but you couldn't easily compete in pro/league play, as I stated up there in my previous post directed at Zmatt ( read for more info ), the gap of skill pro gamers have over people is so large it would look ridiculous to see them play against eachother.

Also your argument makes no sense at all when you really think about it...you say competing and being good in video games just takes time?...well...um...couldn't you say that about everything in life? If I had unlimited time I could learn to be good at anything technically ( negating the whole natural aptitude argument ).

As someone once said to counter your last closing sentence, "your only as good as your competition." Since the pro gamers compete with themselves they are even better then us. If you have never participated in any league or national/coast tournament then you really have no justification in saying you and your friends can compete against the best...Heck me and my CS 1.6 team thought we were the best until we hit Cal-im...then clan after clan made a mockery of us and it really brought us into perspective at how good we were and how good we thought we were...

 

[zmatt]

Actually I did watch the North American Championship for MLG this summer. It was intense. I don't think anyone here is disrespecting pro gamers. the fact of the matter is, we are casual gamers and what works for someone who does it for a living may not apply to average joe gamer. So why should we automatically do what they do? For us its less about winning and more about fun. Some people spend hours and hours training and get really good, they are called pro gamers and they are payed a lot of money to do what they do. I've seen what they go through. Like any "sport" though, most people don't compete at that level and don't do the same thing that the pros do. Do most people go to football camp in the spring for training? No of course not, only pro football players do. So why should any of us hold ourselves to the standard of pro gamers?


Gabb, you are free to emulate them to your heart's content, but most of us just want to spend our free time ****ing around on the server. Don't feel that you have to judge us against them. because you don't and you shouldn't.


EDIT: Also don't double post. Just add it to your last post.

 

[Gabb]

Statements like this:
“At the end of the day, it doesnt take much skill to sit in front of a computer and click a mouse and get kills” -rican
Seem to be ones that convey a sense of disrespect toward pro gamers so that's why I said the comment that I said concerning that, although I suppose it can be argued he meant literally ( meaning not being good but literally just getting kills ) in which case someone just needs to join a TF2 pub and start lobbing demoman grenades all over the place

Concerning the term pro gamers, pro meaning professional of course conveys that the player makes a living off gaming. I however do not include just these people when I use that term since these people are actually a very small part of the “high level of gaming” community and I include people who just play the game and compete in world competitions but don't necessarily make a living off gaming ( example 4k grubby and ksharp, all amazing at their game but neither really made an occupation off of it and pursued other venues of education ).

we are casual gamers and what works for someone who does it for a living may not apply to average joe gamer. So why should we automatically do what they do? For us its less about winning and more about fun.

Zmatt you make a totally valid point by saying this, but the point you make is completely irrelevant to what we are talking about. This subject was first brought up when the grenade launcher imbalance was brought up, I said it was proven imbalanced because pro gamers recognized this and it was banned in all tournaments and leagues. Since pro gamers have the most intimate knowledge of the game they are the ones who can best decide whether something is imbalanced or not. How does you guys not being pro gamers and just having fun in a server have anything to do with this?

I've seen what they go through. Like any "sport" though, most people don't compete at that level and don't do the same thing that the pros do. Do most people go to football camp in the spring for training? No of course not, only pro football players do. So why should any of us hold ourselves to the standard of pro gamers? .

Not everyone goes to football camp just to get better at football but they use tried and true tactics discovered by pro players or at least try too. Unless people are just screwing around in a particular sport, if they play it competitively they try their best to do what the pros have proved are tried and true to win, unless they have their own radical method that is just as effective ( rare case ) I can't see how this can be denied. If you guys are just talking about how to screw around in a game, then any discussion on tactics/strategy/imbalances is irrelevant, but this doesn't seem to be the case. The case seems to be a number of people think the grenade launcher is fine, when myself ( and hopefully others on this forum ) and the professional gaming community see the grenade launcher as an game breaking imbalance and therefore had it banned, I recognize this ban, and others don't and don't see why pro gamers opinions hold so much weight concerning this, when I tried to explain, because they have more intimate knowledge with the game mechanics. That is the topic at hand…realism also can't be brought into the argument as well as we all know game play + balance + mechanics takes precedence over realism.

Last note: some people don't even have time to practice a game to be really competitive at it and I understand, some people don't even have time to spend with their kids etc, lifes tough, thats how it is, but you have to recognize that the people who do have the time to practice something know far more about it then you.

 

[ricanflow]

Gabb, im sorry but you are full of ****.

Pro gamers do not decide whether something is part of a game or not. And with that attitude of yours youve already made some enemies on these forums.

Drop the whole pro gamers thing. We are talking about a weapon. Its a grenade launcher. Yes i can take out four guys in an enclosed area from far away, and i can do it with the rpg and hand grenade too.

No, it doesn't need to be taken out of the game cause a bunch of guys who play games all day think its "unfair" and they cant dodge it and maintain theyre perfect k/d ratio.

Im sorry but im not gonna let some guy who plays games tell me he knows more about something that ive actually fired in real life.

 

[Gabb]

Wow quite a hostile reply, did you even read my posts? Because you don't really address any of the issues I brought up…

Pro gamers do not decide whether something is part of a game or not. And with that attitude of yours youve already made some enemies on these forums. .

Pro gamers actually offered many balancing suggestions to the grenade launcher, since Infinity Ward refused to do anything, high level gaming leagues and tournaments simply took it out themselves with mods. If I've made enemies over my opinions then I don't think they were ever my friends or even neutral to begin with. I don't think theres anything wrong with my attitude… you're the one telling me I'm full of BEEP and resorting to other hostile comments.

No, it doesn't need to be taken out of the game cause a bunch of guys who play games all day think its "unfair" and they cant dodge it and maintain theyre perfect k/d ratio. .

Seems like my previous observations were correct in that you already had a hostile attitude towards pro gamers. On the contrary, “guys who play the games all day” would be better to judge if something was imbalanced and therefore potentially game breaking ( which it is because if it isn't limited everyone will use the GL in pro tournies ) then yourself now wouldn't they? I really can't see how you can deny this…a balance change is the same like when the NBA introduced the 3 second paint rule to prevent players from crowding the paint in professional games and to keep the game more dynamic instead of static, you think just the fans suggested this rule and not the actual professional players or officials who spent a great deal of time monitoring the game?

Im sorry but im not gonna let some guy who plays games tell me he knows more about something that ive actually fired in real life.

You know more about the m203 in real life…but pro gamers know more about the m203 were speaking of…and that's the m203 in COD4. No one is telling you your wrong about the m203 in real life, I don't even know where you got this idea from.