Phantom118
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GSM CEO
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AMEN To that....
molsen
Do work.
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hillbillybob brought up an excellent point earlier in this thread on page 2 or 3, i think. overpenetration.
if you're defending your family from an intruder in your home, you have to consider that many rounds can go through 2 or 3 walls before finally stopping...some will do that even AFTER going through someone's gut. if you miss your target, you might hit someone else. same goes for any other situation. on the street, in an alley, etc.
IMO, it's about finding the balance between stopping power and controllability. THEN, it's about making frequent trips to the range so if you do get into a situation in which you have to shoot someone, you won't be likely to miss.
if you're defending your family from an intruder in your home, you have to consider that many rounds can go through 2 or 3 walls before finally stopping...some will do that even AFTER going through someone's gut. if you miss your target, you might hit someone else. same goes for any other situation. on the street, in an alley, etc.
IMO, it's about finding the balance between stopping power and controllability. THEN, it's about making frequent trips to the range so if you do get into a situation in which you have to shoot someone, you won't be likely to miss.
Amazing how so many people justify carrying a gun for protection against another gun. Common sense would suggest that a gun has no defensive capabilities against another gun, in other words meaning that if a gun were to be shot at you, having your own gun is not going to stop the bullet. If you're scared about getting shot, wear a bulletproof vest everywhere you go and if you are serious, wear full kelvar and helmet.
Any martial artist will tell you that they teach respect for the opponent and that the purpose of martial arts is defense, you are to disable the opponent so that they can't harm you. I have a friend enrolled in Muay Tai classes who has been teaching me the basics, and I will soon be attending the same class myself. I would feel much more confident using the capabilities of my own body to defend myself, if I get shot and killed because of that, whatever, I die with dignity.
This isn't a question of gun control, I could care less if you use a gun for recreational activities so long as you are responsible with it, but the fact that people are actually so open to walking around in public with a concealed weapon they have every intention of pointing and fire at another person staggers my mind. I would think having a gun out in the open would be a more effective way of imposing your safety than hiding it away.
If you want to protect people and do so through the use of firearms, join the military or a police force. If every law abiding citizen walked around with a gun for protection, every criminal would walk around with two
Any martial artist will tell you that they teach respect for the opponent and that the purpose of martial arts is defense, you are to disable the opponent so that they can't harm you. I have a friend enrolled in Muay Tai classes who has been teaching me the basics, and I will soon be attending the same class myself. I would feel much more confident using the capabilities of my own body to defend myself, if I get shot and killed because of that, whatever, I die with dignity.
This isn't a question of gun control, I could care less if you use a gun for recreational activities so long as you are responsible with it, but the fact that people are actually so open to walking around in public with a concealed weapon they have every intention of pointing and fire at another person staggers my mind. I would think having a gun out in the open would be a more effective way of imposing your safety than hiding it away.
If you want to protect people and do so through the use of firearms, join the military or a police force. If every law abiding citizen walked around with a gun for protection, every criminal would walk around with two
Phantom118
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^said it perfactly
Anyone ever think of pepperspray???? it comes in varying strengths... if your worried about it not stopping somebody get a higher grade.. and you dont have to worry about killing someone.. you want defence??? walk around with a billastics shield. Offence??? then a gun.. like gaara said a gun is not intended for defencive purpose's.
Anyone ever think of pepperspray???? it comes in varying strengths... if your worried about it not stopping somebody get a higher grade.. and you dont have to worry about killing someone.. you want defence??? walk around with a billastics shield. Offence??? then a gun.. like gaara said a gun is not intended for defencive purpose's.
That's a good point, I've walked into a cloud of pepperspray about 30 seconds after it was sprayed and my entire face cringed and my eyes felt like sandpaper, it's very effective and the chances of it being lethal seem slim to none unless someone unloads an entire can in someones eye....
LoTeX
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Uh-oh! The famous "one last question"...! Well, it was nice knowing you all. Farewell, cruel world!
Oh, the answer. I realize my views may seem liberal (I think liberty is a good thing) to certain kinds of people, like rednecks or right wing extremists or even some tech-forum members.
It's just the way I figure things out, I try to think the "big picture" or "outside the box". I call it common sense. I value life and am not ready to end it by the means of saving some tax money or something as ridiculous as that. If I had to choose between killing someone or causing someone a permanent limp, I'd choose the latter, no question about it. Luckily I haven't had to make that decision and hopefully never will.I have to admit, I like hugging! Sorry for being a sissy, but I think it's much better to hug someone, than to shoot someone. But apparently hugging is not cool or manly.
hillbillybob
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I have to admit, I like hugging! Sorry for being a sissy, but I think it's much better to hug someone, than to shoot someone. But apparently hugging is not cool or manly.
Meh, im not a touchy feely person. As for pepperspray, valid point, but it won't stop someone tweaked out.
As for concealed weapons - what is a pocket knife?
The term liberal didn't come from liberty, but that is a different debate for a different time.
*sigh*
If you get a gun, don't just get a gun. Think it through, research what you want. Size, caliber, formfactor, etc. You will probably go through 4 or 5 handguns before you find one that you like, that feels good in your hand, and of the proper caliber. Research your rounds, Hollow point vs Full Metal Jacket, regular vs +p ammo, standard vs magnum rounds. Every ammo manufacturers site has a ballistics chart. That will give you the information you need like muzzle velocity, drop, bullet grain weight, displacement, deformation, etc. Your goal(s) with a self defense gun are as follows -
1.)accuracy
2.)overpenetration prevention
3.)stopping power
4.)controllability (for those follow up shots should they be needed)
5.)concealability
Respect your firearm, respect other people, and lastly, respect yourself. Responsibility is key, and practice, practice, practice. To give you an example, some elite military groups are required to put 100 rounds down range, every day. This ensures high levels of accuracy.
FireFox
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Guns are also good defensive weapons. To shoot to kill is a last resort -- I'd rather shoot to maim but it depends on the situation. If I were to shoot then I'd aim for the thigh for several reasons....I'll list a couple...
1. It more then likely won't kill the person.
2. It'll incapacitate 'em.
3. And if it does over penetrate, it will hit the ground shortly after penetrating.
Pepper spray is very limited in range. Of course, it's great for PERSONAL defense, but not so great for anyone elses defense. I'm the type of person that hates to standby and watch as someone else is being physically harmed and/or threatened. If any of you salty seadogs don't mind watching someone else being harmed and just glad that it isn't you then fine....go about your hugging business.
The idea of concealing your weapon is so that noone else knows it's there (obviously). It's there if you need it and that's all. Noone else knows nor do they need to know. If you were to go around carrying a gun that isn't concealed then all you'll do is draw a ton of unwanted attention to yourself and make yourself a giant target.
Sure, carrying a gun around may not be practical these days, but I''d much rather have one then be in a situation where I wish I had one.
The "if someone is pointing a gun at you" scenario is a very stupid scenario. If someone is pointing a gun at you then you OBVIOUSLY don't want to be drawing a gun. At this point, the gun is CONCEALED and the person who is assaulting you has no CLUE that you have one. If all the assaultant wants is your wallet or whatever then you GIVE IT TO HIM as that's the only reasonably smart thing to do. Noone is questioning that. What does carrying a concealed gun got to do with that? NOTHING. Anyway, the reasoning and examples given in this thread are very poor. Quite a few good points have been mentioned though. Anyway, after you give him whatever he wants and if he puts his guard down and runs away then pull it out and put one in his leg. Simple. Just use common sense. There is absolutely NOTHING crazy about having a concealed gun.
Anyway, I had a lot more that was on my mind that I wanted to say, but I've started to cool down a bit for now.
1. It more then likely won't kill the person.
2. It'll incapacitate 'em.
3. And if it does over penetrate, it will hit the ground shortly after penetrating.
Pepper spray is very limited in range. Of course, it's great for PERSONAL defense, but not so great for anyone elses defense. I'm the type of person that hates to standby and watch as someone else is being physically harmed and/or threatened. If any of you salty seadogs don't mind watching someone else being harmed and just glad that it isn't you then fine....go about your hugging business.
The idea of concealing your weapon is so that noone else knows it's there (obviously). It's there if you need it and that's all. Noone else knows nor do they need to know. If you were to go around carrying a gun that isn't concealed then all you'll do is draw a ton of unwanted attention to yourself and make yourself a giant target.
Sure, carrying a gun around may not be practical these days, but I''d much rather have one then be in a situation where I wish I had one.
The "if someone is pointing a gun at you" scenario is a very stupid scenario. If someone is pointing a gun at you then you OBVIOUSLY don't want to be drawing a gun. At this point, the gun is CONCEALED and the person who is assaulting you has no CLUE that you have one. If all the assaultant wants is your wallet or whatever then you GIVE IT TO HIM as that's the only reasonably smart thing to do. Noone is questioning that. What does carrying a concealed gun got to do with that? NOTHING. Anyway, the reasoning and examples given in this thread are very poor. Quite a few good points have been mentioned though. Anyway, after you give him whatever he wants and if he puts his guard down and runs away then pull it out and put one in his leg. Simple. Just use common sense. There is absolutely NOTHING crazy about having a concealed gun.
Anyway, I had a lot more that was on my mind that I wanted to say, but I've started to cool down a bit for now.
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