Curious About Some Things Regarding Modem/Router...

Easy John

Baseband Member
Messages
50
Location
U.K.
Currently, there are a lot of people in my household. Everyone connects to me, as I'm the one who pays for the Internet, and also the one who owns the standard Virgin Media Modem and NetGear Wireless Router (bought separately years ago).

This is where it gets complicated for me. See, I've heard that if even just one person who's got access to the wireless network has a virus of some sort, then everyone on the wireless network could potentially all be infected through the virus propagating itself to different devices connected to it, even with top security, like Avast or AVG, or whatever it's called, etc., etc..

Now, I'll be buying a new laptop pretty soon anyway, so I figure that this is a great time to start fresh, making sure anything I transfer from current computer to laptop is virus-free. I really don't want to deal with viruses right from the get-go (especially if it's true about people being connected to the network passing on viruses to everybody).

To avoid any nasties altogether, my plan is to keep the current wireless setup with the current computer I'm using right now, and only use this option when everyone wants to use my connection, but whenever I get time to myself to surf the web, check emails, or whatever, I'll use the new laptop (which I plan to install some good antivirus gear on) and anything else that's mine (and virus-free) with a completely separate modem/router combo. This way, I'm thinking it's a good way to just avoid everybody else's craziness, because, let me tell you, the people in my household don't even take care what's on their systems, and I don't want to have to suffer because of all of that plain stupidity.

I know it sounds a little bit extreme, but I'm just curious about it.

I guess I'll summarise:


1.
Is it true about viruses from one device affecting other devices also connected to the same network, even if, say, some of the devices have great antivirus security, etc.?


2.
Would this idea of switching from one setup of standard Virgin Media Modem and NetGear Router to another Modem/Router combo at different times be effective? Or is there something standing in the way of that; like, is it unhealthy tech-wise to keep switching back and forth between different setups to the wireless cable, or is it only damaging to actual electronic devices (modems/routers) if it were them being switched on, off, on...? Oh, and, not sure how it works if you're in the U.S., but here in the U.K. to get the signal from Virgin Media, it's basically a little white wire that you have to sort of twist, kind of like one of those old brown coaxial wires for TVs that seem to have been around forever.


I know this is probably basic stuff, but I'm no expert with any of it. I just so happen to have enough good sense to try and avoid the crazies in my household with their virus-ridden systems.
 
1. Possible yes - all depends on the malware/virus in question. Some can/do spread over the network onto other systems that have sharing enabled and/or public folders enabled that don't require credentials to connect to.

2. Are all the other clients connected to wifi? If so...setup a guest wifi network that's separate from the one you use. Then the 2 networks will have internet access still, but be separate on the router / LAN level. You would only need 1 modem and 1 router still.

If you wanted totally separate networks, then you could get another router and plug it into the existing router and set it up on a separate subnet so that both LANs have no knowledge of one another - but still have internet access on each. Either way... you only need 1 modem as the modem is what connects you from your ISP.
 
1. Possible yes - all depends on the malware/virus in question. Some can/do spread over the network onto other systems that have sharing enabled and/or public folders enabled that don't require credentials to connect to.

2. Are all the other clients connected to wifi? If so...setup a guest wifi network that's separate from the one you use. Then the 2 networks will have internet access still, but be separate on the router / LAN level. You would only need 1 modem and 1 router still.

If you wanted totally separate networks, then you could get another router and plug it into the existing router and set it up on a separate subnet so that both LANs have no knowledge of one another - but still have internet access on each. Either way... you only need 1 modem as the modem is what connects you from your ISP.

1. I was talking to some other users from another site, and they said something about it not being possible as the virus has no 'entry point', or something like that. I kept telling them I swore I heard somewhere something about certain viruses being able to attack, regardless of the type of security. They said as long as you aren't on a homegroup you'll be fine, but that sounds too simple to me... Any truth to what they said?

2. If by clients you mean others in the household on the network using WiFi as the method of connection, then, yes, they all are using WiFi... but wouldn't their device name appear anyway, whether wired or wireless? As for the guest WiFi, does that really help protect against some of those crazy viruses out there? I feel they'd still have a way to get around it, right? Also, how exactly can they be separate on the Router/LAN level? If it's too complicated to explain, never mind about that. The basics are alright with me

3. Totally separate networks? I think I get what you mean, here, but would they really be separate, though? I get the general idea of how they'd be separate, but because they're connected in some way (both on the modem), I'm thinking it's dangerous one way or another. Maybe I'm thinking too deep, but I'm just trying to escape my crazy family, you know? some of them just don't give a damn.
 
1. I was talking to some other users from another site, and they said something about it not being possible as the virus has no 'entry point', or something like that. I kept telling them I swore I heard somewhere something about certain viruses being able to attack, regardless of the type of security. They said as long as you aren't on a homegroup you'll be fine, but that sounds too simple to me... Any truth to what they said?
Not at all... Homegroups haven't been around that long, and viruses / malware (particularly worms) have been able to spread on networks for years and years. Domain environments, workgroup environments, etc. As long as the user that's infected has WRITE permissions on a network share/location, the malware can spread to that location. That's one of the reasons why Cryptolocker is so damaging - if it infects a workstation in a company with write access to a lot of network shares...it can spread quite easily.

2. If by clients you mean others in the household on the network using WiFi as the method of connection, then, yes, they all are using WiFi... but wouldn't their device name appear anyway, whether wired or wireless? As for the guest WiFi, does that really help protect against some of those crazy viruses out there? I feel they'd still have a way to get around it, right? Also, how exactly can they be separate on the Router/LAN level? If it's too complicated to explain, never mind about that. The basics are alright with me
The devices on the Guest network would be visible to each other, but the devices on the "normal" network would not be visible to the devices on the Guest network. Yes it would help prevent malware spreading to your "normal" / non-guest network because of the reasons I just stated.

They're separate in the fact that the the physical network is split into separate virtual networks.

3. Totally separate networks? I think I get what you mean, here, but would they really be separate, though? I get the general idea of how they'd be separate, but because they're connected in some way (both on the modem), I'm thinking it's dangerous one way or another. Maybe I'm thinking too deep, but I'm just trying to escape my crazy family, you know? some of them just don't give a damn.

Systems on the same network connected to a router don't go all the way back to the modem level to communicate with each other - all communication between systems is done through the router (or a switch if that's how you have them hooked up). The only time a system goes up to the router level is when it connects to an external address, i.e. a website on the internet.
 
Not at all... Homegroups haven't been around that long, and viruses / malware (particularly worms) have been able to spread on networks for years and years. Domain environments, workgroup environments, etc. As long as the user that's infected has WRITE permissions on a network share/location, the malware can spread to that location. That's one of the reasons why Cryptolocker is so damaging - if it infects a workstation in a company with write access to a lot of network shares...it can spread quite easily.


The devices on the Guest network would be visible to each other, but the devices on the "normal" network would not be visible to the devices on the Guest network. Yes it would help prevent malware spreading to your "normal" / non-guest network because of the reasons I just stated.

They're separate in the fact that the the physical network is split into separate virtual networks.



Systems on the same network connected to a router don't go all the way back to the modem level to communicate with each other - all communication between systems is done through the router (or a switch if that's how you have them hooked up). The only time a system goes up to the router level is when it connects to an external address, i.e. a website on the internet.

What can I say? Some good info there. I don't know how this works, but you're a Moderator, so I guess you'll know. I'd like to keep this thread open, just in case something else pops in my head that I forgot about. Is that alright? If so, great, if not, damn. Either way, great info to get me started. Thanks.

P.S. I clicked that little thing for the 'Thanks', or whatever it was. Tried it again for your other reply, but it said something about spreading the thanks around first, before coming back... I don't know.:confused:
 
What can I say? Some good info there. I don't know how this works, but you're a Moderator, so I guess you'll know. I'd like to keep this thread open, just in case something else pops in my head that I forgot about. Is that alright? If so, great, if not, damn. Either way, great info to get me started. Thanks.
Yep it can stay open. No issue with that.

P.S. I clicked that little thing for the 'Thanks', or whatever it was. Tried it again for your other reply, but it said something about spreading the thanks around first, before coming back... I don't know.:confused:

Yeah the thanks system is kinda bugged - doesn't allow the same person to give thanks to the same person multiple times in a row.
 
Hey EJohn, Id suggest you hide your main SSID, so your family dont keep trying to connect to it. I think it will knock them off the wifi once you make it hidden, so you dont have to remove it from each device, if not just change the password. This is also always recommended for security.
 
Thanks for the feedback, guys...

I guess I kind of need some more info now. I'll try to make it as short and to the point as possible.

See, I don't mind others using me for Internet access. I try to be the good guy and help others out, just so they don't have to pay for something I could just give them. At the same time, I'll also do my best to stay secure to avoid bad and unnecessary things happening. This is why it's a very specific situation I'm in. Anyway, I've been veering more toward the idea of having multiple routers, just to cut confusion with all this SSID, changing passwords all the time (which I do every now and again in desperate times), etc..

I guess what I'm curious about is the idea of it being dangerous to the router itself (the one that I'd have everyone connect to). You may wonder what I'm going on about. What I mean is, say, things were running slowly for me because everybody is downloading, etc., and I really need to get something done online. Now, say I've got everybody in the household connecting to the router I just mentioned. If I had to keep pulling this particular router's Ethernet out of my main router (the one I'd be using for just me) and putting it back in all the time, for the sake of convenience (if I notice things running slowly for me, and really need the speed), is this really alright to do so? I'm thinking it's bad for the router. You know, electronically damaging. Come to think of it, I'm curious if it's also damaging to the main router I'd be using for just my own devices.

I guess this next part should have been the original question. Anyway, if I do things this way, would the router that every other user in the house connects to be connected to my main router through Ethernet? You know, like Virgin Media modem from the ISP connecting to the main router (the one for just me) to any other device of mine, but have the second router (the one I set up for everyone else to connect to) be connected through Ethernet to the main router? For the previous paragraph I just assumed this is the way it'd be done.
 
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