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Old 08-17-2007, 09:59 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Default Re: need beef - advice please!!!

ok thanks, keep the suggestions coming people.

well vernon1992, thanks. i am trying to build a bit of a beast, i want to do some 3d work and games, lots of power hungry stuff. but i want to test the water first by putting in an opty and OCing that. do you think a 6000+ is better than an OCed opty 165? i mean cache-wise they are the same but with the 6000+ you can have faster ram. i'm right? this is the only benefit? which cpu has the most potential? i've been looking for a benchmark comparison for ages but can't find one. i understand the opty is very good with older software as well as new.
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Old 08-18-2007, 10:24 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Default Re: need beef - advice please!!!

you can use "faster" ram yes...but the latency is usually around double for ddr2 vs ddr....so it really isnt that much faster.
the opty will not hit 3.5ghz without some serious cooling, if even then. it may do 3 on air...probably a little lower than that. apokalipse's 6000 runs at 3.5ghz, with water cooling. i am not to sure how far it would go on air. so, an oc'd 165 may be close to equal to a stock 6000, but the 6000 can be overclocked past the oc'd speed of the 165.
so, if the opty 165 is within your budget, i say go with that, if you dont want to rebuild your entire system at the moment. although buying a used one is like..."meh". you're taking your chances with that. also, be prepared, because people are going to tell you how dumb you are for building a (new) amd system instead of intel. lol STFW its your money.
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Old 08-18-2007, 01:22 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: need beef - advice please!!!

thanks for all the help dude.

well i understand your point about amd being second to intel but meh, you pay a lot more with intel for a little more speed, always been. i also don't like the company.
check this comparison out CPU Charts | Tom's Hardware

i can buy a new amd 6000+ for 106.16 but the intel qx6850 (their fastest desktop processor i believe) is 681.44 new. here's some maths based on the benchmark above:

intel's score is 1.57 times that of amd's. intel's cost is 6.42 times that of amd's. the extra 57 percent speed costs you 575.28. that's an expensive 3521 benchmark points!! perhaps for 575.28 you could get the amd to be faster than the intel AND pay your electricity bill for a high-power refridgeration cooler.

quick question, would you say my 2gigs of ddr1 would be faster than 1gig of ddr2, if my system was only using 1gig? i mean each module should run at 200mhz, beating 1 module at double. or would my ram not work like that? can i FORCE it to? (use both modules evenly i mean)

i wonder how cool you'd have to run the opty to get it to 3.5ghz.

how much is a new dual core opty 165 in the states then? i could airmail. if i'm going to get little benefit over an opty with a 6000 then i might just go opty for the next year.

last of all, i asked someone on ebay why they were selling their opty:

hi, I built quad core intel system now at 3ghz with 2gb memory and gigabyte board - still have same graphic card from old system - gf8800 gts with thermalright hr-03 cooler. is faster but overkill for today games - my old setup handled all with no problems at all. And yes it is powerfull. Mind you I used Akasa AK-920-2 EVO 120 on opteron which i'll be selling soon - nice compact and powerfull - I used that till last week on quad intel chip with no problem. I have box for board with manual, cables, brackets, sli bridge, cd-s. Memory is good as gold - I paid 140 for it alone :-) - should run up to 288mhz - 576mhz effective. I never tried that though - I play on safe side in oc. I shoul still have a bill for board as well just in case something goes wrong later.
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Old 08-18-2007, 01:28 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: need beef - advice please!!!

It isn't a fair comparison between the 6000+ and QX6850, because the QX6850 has 2 more cores, 6mb more of L2 cache, and it's the extreme edition. 6000+'s counterpart is the E6600 or E6550.

You would need watercooling, or a peltier device, to get an Opteron to 3.5GHz.

An Opteron 165, cost about $100 in the US.
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Old 08-18-2007, 01:48 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: need beef - advice please!!!

i know what the counterpart is but my point still stands that you pay a huge premium to get not such a big speed increase.

ok, i can get an e6600, which is £132.72, so not much more than the amd. but if you look at the benchmarks it is neck and neck with the amd 6000.

i could ask how they compare with overclocking but i can't see the intel going much higher than the amd with the same cooling- am i wrong?

am i missing the point? these benchmarks do look quite good. the only thing tom's hardware don't benchmark is multiple apps at once. i suspect the quad cores would come out shining.

EDIT: perhaps i should only slag off the qx8650 when i've compared it to the top-end opties? what does amd have in the pipeline?
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Old 08-18-2007, 01:51 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: need beef - advice please!!!

With the same cooling, such as a Tuniq CPU cooler, the E6600 would overclock further.

Those benchmarks from Tom's Hardware, aren't exactly accurate.
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Old 08-26-2007, 10:56 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Default Re: need beef - advice please!!!

In a few hours I will be ordering a new opty 170. I found one for about $108 including delivery.
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Old 08-26-2007, 11:06 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: need beef - advice please!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Comdot View Post
thanks for all the advice guys. i've had my work cut out reading up on all the new cpu models now. first i want to look at what's the best i can get without changing my mobo, and if i don't like the look of it i'll upgrade that along with the ram when i get my new cpu.

taintedplay, i guess you're in the u.s. so i'm not sure i wanna unless the exchange rate on my redcoat money makes up for the shipping . u.s. goods are cheaper anyway, you lucky luckers, so i might be in luck :P.

nagasama- yeah i did try to make it neat, just a few cable ties really. and sorry, the 90nm brisbane WAS a windsor, my mistake!

ok now for cooling, how do you guys rate this :right_arrow: Thermaltake Bigwater 745 CL-W0076 Liquid Cooler they claim to have the biggest stock of cooling in the uk. bearing in mind that is within my budget (50 to 100 in the uk), is there anything you see from specialtech (or in the u.s!) of that price which you think is a better solution? (k8 series amd).
NOOOOO! Don't get that liquid cooling system. When I first built my gaming pc I ordered that to cool it, and the waterblock leaked (no, not from the connections.) So I sent it back and got a new one....that one's radiator leaked. I sent that back and they gave another one with a defective waterblock. I would suggest staying away from Thermaltake for watercooling.
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Old 08-26-2007, 11:10 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Default Re: need beef - advice please!!!

Thanks for the advice man, I hadn't really given that particular water cooler or brand that much consideration. That sounds bad what happened to you. I've bought a TEC cooler which is as it happens Thermaltake. I haven't received it yet. Now I hope it's reliable!
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Old 08-27-2007, 06:12 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: need beef - advice please!!!

The opty should be on it's way now. I also ordered two 250GB Samsung Spinpoint SATA2 8MB disks. This is what my system is about to look like.

Asus A8N32-SLI Deluxe 939 (to keep for now)
Opteron 170 (to keep for now)
2 GB Kingston 3200 (to keep for now)
XFX 7600 GS SLI 256MB (to upgrade)
Maxtor DiamondMax 10 200GB (to keep)
2x 250GB Samsung Spinpoint SATA2 8MB in RAID 0 (keep)
Lite-on CD/DVDburner (keep)
Generic CD/DVD drive (keep)
Hauppauge WinTV Nova-T (keep)
Cooling: AC 64 Pro or Thermaltake SubZero4G (whichever turns out better I'll keep)
400W PSU (to keep for now)
IBM ThinkVision C220P 22" CRT (to keep)

I'm looking for a graphics card now, think I'll go for an 8800GTS. A while after I get that I'll probably go AM2 and get a 6000+ and DDR2. I really depends on how much I think a 6000+ and DDR2 is going to improve things, bearing in mind the cost of an AM2 mobo, 2GB RAM, and a more expensive CPU. I'd even have the option of going intel if I could just stop thinking they're a great rip-off.

I also want a sound card at some point. Any ideas what's hot? 5.1 surround would be nice to have! Something with good output from games too.
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