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Old 10-28-2008, 04:30 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Exclamation Air flow improvements ( Need Advice )

Hey although I plan to RMA my evga 8800 gtx in December when I go on vacation for 2 weeks because it gets as hot as 90+ celcius during gaming and sometimes crashes ( idles at 75 during hot days ) I figure a large part of my problem is my air flow. I have a thermaltake armor case and I think my q6600 chips are at acceptable temps ( my HSF is a tuniq tower and the chips never go over 58 celcius during load ). The thermaltake armor case comes with 2 intake fans ( one top and front ) and 1 exhaust fan in the back. The fans themselves seem pretty weak ( especially my PSU fan ) and don’t seem to intake or exhaust that much air at all. Theres no more space for any additional fans so I figure all I can do now is concentrate on air flow since the air gets really hot underneath my desk where my computer resides. Currently my setup is this:


WWWWWWWWWW
DAAAAAA2AAA 1 D
DAAAAAAAAAA C D
DAAAAAAAAAA C D
DAAAAAAAAAA C D

D= desk walls
W=room wall
C= computer tower
A=empty space
1=spot 1 referenced below
2=spot 2 reference below

The computer tower is underneath the desk and as you can see has very little room in the back ( just enough to fit a small fan through all the wiring coming out from behind and unfortunately no room on the rear right side. I was thinking to maybe have an external intake fan on the left side ( spot 2 ) pushing the hot air from under the desk or maybe squeezing a small external exhaust fan ( spot 1 ) directly behind the computer pointing to the right to push the hot air to the right side and hopefully the majority of the hot air from under the desk. I don’t know much about air flow…anyone have any ideas? Typically rivatuner reports ambient temperatures of 10 degrees less then the GPU temp, which means around 70-85 celcius during gaming which yes I know is very hot, I have no idea how accurate rivatuner is but the air is pretty hot back there, any advice would be appreciated as well as which fans to recommend.

PS: Also is there anyway to increase the fan RPM without totally destroying my case fans or whatever? I don’t know too much about this stuff…sometimes I even think my case fans are dying since they seem so weak
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Old 10-28-2008, 07:01 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Air flow improvements ( Need Advice )

I have the armour and i am pretty sure the stock fans are not adjustable (not three phase or whatever its called...)

I dont think that fan would really help personally, and I have the exact same desk setup as you. I would suggest maybe investing in some better fans like some noctua ones. Also, try changing the top 80mm fan to an exhast instead of intake. This will help the rising heat escape faster rather than be trapped by incoming air.
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Old 10-28-2008, 08:27 PM   #3 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Air flow improvements ( Need Advice )

I must just be slow, I don't get the diagram....wire management would knock down temps to allow better air flow, depending on what yours is like now. As mentioned, better fans, higher cfm. I don't know how much additional intake will help you as your intake already exceeds your output. How do you feel about case modding? Maybe add a second intake in the plexy wall over the GPU and then turn the top intake into an output so you'd have air in front/side and out back/top. Could also try an aftermarket cooler on the gpu, I run accelero S1 rev2s on both my 8800gt's and it dropped temps each by about 6 degrees without any fans on them.

I'm using my backup folding rig right now, I have SLI 8800gt's and the 5000+ all OCed...CPU@3.26, GPU: 710/1800/1000 with the stock 690 case and my temps are good, at load I get 46 on the CPU and 62 on the GPUs. ON the gpus' thats more than a 10C drop after doing wire management and switching out for the aftermarket cooler. Neither are huge OCs but are relatively high for 24/7 operation IMO.
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Old 10-28-2008, 08:39 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Air flow improvements ( Need Advice )

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Originally Posted by jfenwick View Post
I must just be slow, I don't get the diagram....wire management would knock down temps to allow better air flow, depending on what yours is like now. As mentioned, better fans, higher cfm. I don't know how much additional intake will help you as your intake already exceeds your output. How do you feel about case modding? Maybe add a second intake in the plexy wall over the GPU and then turn the top intake into an output so you'd have air in front/side and out back/top. Could also try an aftermarket cooler on the gpu, I run accelero S1 rev2s on both my 8800gt's and it dropped temps each by about 6 degrees without any fans on them.

I'm using my backup folding rig right now, I have SLI 8800gt's and the 5000+ all OCed...CPU@3.26, GPU: 710/1800/1000 with the stock 690 case and my temps are good, at load I get 46 on the CPU and 62 on the GPUs. ON the gpus' thats more than a 10C drop after doing wire management and switching out for the aftermarket cooler. Neither are huge OCs but are relatively high for 24/7 operation IMO.
Hmmm a few questions
1. How do you know my intake exceeds my outtake?
2. Is it really helpful to turn the top intake fan into an exhaust? why did they make it a intake to begin with since doesn't hot air rise up?
3. I don't really feel comfortable with aftermarket coolers and my 8800 gtx is already too big as it is

also I maxed wire management as best I could and theres only SATA cables no IDE, also I really hate how the SATA ports are right next to the video card so the wires can't help but block the stock cooler on the card a bit.

PS: The diagram I provided is a plan view ( top down ) not a side view with me sitting in the desk facing the wall
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Old 10-28-2008, 08:47 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Air flow improvements ( Need Advice )

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Originally Posted by jfenwick View Post
I must just be slow, I don't get the diagram....wire management would knock down temps to allow better air flow, depending on what yours is like now. As mentioned, better fans, higher cfm. ... How do you feel about case modding? Maybe add a second intake in the plexy wall over the GPU and then turn the top intake into an output so you'd have air in front/side and out back/top.
^^exactly what i was thinking^^

if you even just do some ghetto cable management (wrap everything up together in electrical tape... and tuck the unused wires somewhere else if you dont have a mod psu) you should be able to lower your temps by 5-10C... you'll also wanna flip that top fan around to blow the hot air out so your CPU isnt stewing in its own heat... and adding a side fan to get some cold air into the bottom which'll help cool the GPU

and if you lap the CPU and cooler as well you'll be able to keep your cores under50C at load without a problem
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Old 10-28-2008, 09:47 PM   #6 (permalink)
 
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Default Re: Air flow improvements ( Need Advice )

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Originally Posted by Gabb View Post
Hmmm a few questions
1. How do you know my intake exceeds my outtake?
2. Is it really helpful to turn the top intake fan into an exhaust? why did they make it a intake to begin with since doesn't hot air rise up?
3. I don't really feel comfortable with aftermarket coolers and my 8800 gtx is already too big as it is

also I maxed wire management as best I could and theres only SATA cables no IDE, also I really hate how the SATA ports are right next to the video card so the wires can't help but block the stock cooler on the card a bit.

PS: The diagram I provided is a plan view ( top down ) not a side view with me sitting in the desk facing the wall
1. You told me what type of case you had...i just took a look online at it. What's the exact model number, different armor's have different options.

2. Different cases, different designs, depends on how they want their air movement.

3. The stock cooler on the 8800gts isn't too bad, not like the stock 8800gt i have. You could pull the cooler and change the paste, MX-2 might drop you another couple of degrees.

The stock cooler on the 8800gts pushes the air out the back...or atleast that's the design theory. the SATA cables shouldn't interfere with that function.

Well, don't really know what else to tell you...
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Old 10-28-2008, 10:18 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Air flow improvements ( Need Advice )

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2. Is it really helpful to turn the top intake fan into an exhaust? why did they make it a intake to begin with since doesn't hot air rise up?
It should be, and my case did not come with it installed...give it a try at least.
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Old 10-29-2008, 02:10 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Air flow improvements ( Need Advice )

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It should be, and my case did not come with it installed...give it a try at least.
my case didn't come with it either, I have the 8000 BWS without the side fan

what does everyone think about my external fan ideas? Currently I got a small high powered external fan that I want to put in spot 1 facing left so it can blow the hot air that comes out of the back to the right and hopefully help circulate the air
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Old 10-29-2008, 07:41 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Air flow improvements ( Need Advice )

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my case didn't come with it either, I have the 8000 BWS without the side fan

what does everyone think about my external fan ideas? Currently I got a small high powered external fan that I want to put in spot 1 facing left so it can blow the hot air that comes out of the back to the right and hopefully help circulate the air
A good test would be to pull it out from under the desk, into the middle of the room, and then check temps agains the ones while it is under the desk. If it drops dramatically then yeh the fan is probably a good idea.
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Old 10-29-2008, 10:25 AM   #10 (permalink)
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A good test would be to pull it out from under the desk, into the middle of the room, and then check temps agains the ones while it is under the desk. If it drops dramatically then yeh the fan is probably a good idea.
Yeah unfortunately due to some short wires ( the DVI cable mostly is way too short and really the limiting factor compared to the other cables ) this can't be done, however what I will do today is run a benchmark and see the temps and then wait a bit for it to cool and then run the benchmark with the fan in the back turned on and then see the temps, also plan to do a idle temp test as well. My only worry is the external fan in the back will be pushing hot air back into the computer even though its not pointed in that direction. Air flow seems to be a relatively confusing calculation

Oh and a lot of reviews concerned the side thermaltake armor fan said it really isn't worth the $35 something dollars cause despite being so large the side fan runs at a really low rpm
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