Actually, one of the people I used to have endless debates with is no longer so against Apple...for two reasons. One, like many others, he was mostly against them because of my [former] school's complete garbage 333MHz flower power iMacs with huge activity restrictions (they even replaced the finder shell with something absolutely disgusting called "panels"). Two, because of the new hardware (G5) and the UNIX base, terminal integration, and X11. Number Two is something that got some Linux geeks to respect them a bit more.