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Old 05-05-2011, 05:29 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Microsoft: 'Do the math' before you buy a Mac

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I could have gotten a faster laptop for a lower price but compared to my MBP it would have been flimsy plastic, there wouldn't have been a glass panel over the LCD, the DC jack would probably break after a while (I've had bad luck with laptop power supply's and DC jacks, and the trackpad would have been less than half the size and wouldn't have had the gestures (two finger scrolling, two finger right click, swipe, pinch etc.) that MacBook's glass trackpad has. For me it wasn't all about specs when I bought my laptop, I wanted something that I knew was good quality, would last a long time, and had a big trackpad.
Funny my ThinkPad was ~$200 cheaper than a Macbook Pro 13 yet it is more durable (I've seen plenty of dented Macs) has a matte IPS screen instead of the MBP's glossy TN panel and it even has better battery life so I don't have to worry about plugging it in anywhere but my desk. I also get built in mobile broadband and a mSata slot so I can run a SSD and hard drive in the same system. On a Mac you can't even use a SSD and get Trim support unless it's one of the horrible drives Apple offers.
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Old 05-05-2011, 06:01 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Microsoft: 'Do the math' before you buy a Mac

The article sounds like it was written by a Mac fanboy.

Apple makes good stuff, but the price includes the price of the privlege of having that Apple logo on whatever it is. Always has, always will. that does not keep their stuff from working like it is supposed to work, though.
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Old 05-05-2011, 06:27 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Microsoft: 'Do the math' before you buy a Mac

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Funny my ThinkPad was ~$200 cheaper than a Macbook Pro 13 yet it is more durable (I've seen plenty of dented Macs) has a matte IPS screen instead of the MBP's glossy TN panel and it even has better battery life so I don't have to worry about plugging it in anywhere but my desk. I also get built in mobile broadband and a mSata slot so I can run a SSD and hard drive in the same system. On a Mac you can't even use a SSD and get Trim support unless it's one of the horrible drives Apple offers.
Aluminum dents a lot easier than plastic, but plastic wears down faster and cracks. My dad has one of those Lenovo ThinkPad's (he said ThinkPad's have gone down hill a lot after IBM stopped making them) that he got from his work. It also has a tiny trackpad and that horrible DC jack/power supply. My mid 2010 MPB was rated for a 10 hour battery life which is more than enough for school and other things.

And OS X 10.7 Lion is going to have TRIM support and that's coming out soon.
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Old 05-05-2011, 07:46 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Microsoft: 'Do the math' before you buy a Mac

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Aluminum dents a lot easier than plastic, but plastic wears down faster and cracks. My dad has one of those Lenovo ThinkPad's (he said ThinkPad's have gone down hill a lot after IBM stopped making them) that he got from his work. It also has a tiny trackpad and that horrible DC jack/power supply. My mid 2010 MPB was rated for a 10 hour battery life which is more than enough for school and other things.

And OS X 10.7 Lion is going to have TRIM support and that's coming out soon.
If you read any reviews of the newest generation of ThinkPad's they have hardly gone down hill, in fact they may be the best ones yet. The x220 in particular has gotten exceptional reviews and has the distinction of being one of only a handful of laptops on the market offered with a IPS display.

Lion only has Trim support for Apple branded SSD's which are all worthless, they cost a fortune and use cheap controllers.

I've worked with plenty of cheap laptops and have never seen one that's cracked, much less a ThinkPad. I'd be willing to bet a Thinkpad could easily hold up to abuse that would kill a Macbook Pro.

Is Apple's DC jack really so good that it not only makes up for a noticeably inferior screen but also justifies a steep price premium?

Yes the trackpad on the ThinkPad is smaller in order to leave more room for the keyboard. IMO touchpad's are just a backup anyways, anyone who is doing real work on a laptop will likely be using a mouse in the first place. That said the multitouch touchpad on the x220 is actually pretty good.

The smallest battery on the x220 is good for 8 hours of real world and the 9 cell model I have easily tops that. In contrast a Macbook Pro 13 with the same cpu is only rated for 7 hours by Apple and in the real world it will likely be even lower still. Plus if I need more battery life I can easily swap in a replacement battery or attach an external slice battery which boots the battery life to roughly 24 hours.

I'd also argue that the ThinkPad is much better looking but looks are subjective.
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Old 05-05-2011, 08:10 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Microsoft: 'Do the math' before you buy a Mac

^ditto.
My first MBP (didn't buy it, got it free from work) was recently replaced due to fact that the front and back had dented in, as well as a little dent on the top lid. I don't think I'm particularly careless, but I do take it around a lot in my bag. Even in such an awesome bag like that, these dents just magically appeared over time.

Plastic 'cracking' on other laptops? Really? No. DC Jack breaking after a while? I guess if you routinely swing from them. I've got a ton of older model laptops here at work (both the old macbooks and windows-based models). None of them except one have problems with the jack, and that one got knocked off a bench. Needless to say it's got a couple other problems as well now

The one thing I like better on my MBP is the trackpad. I haven't found one as good on a non-apple laptop. That being said, I'm not about to spend a couple hundred extra over comparable (or better) hardware just for an upgraded trackpad.
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Old 05-05-2011, 09:21 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Microsoft: 'Do the math' before you buy a Mac

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^ditto.
My first MBP (didn't buy it, got it free from work) was recently replaced due to fact that the front and back had dented in, as well as a little dent on the top lid. I don't think I'm particularly careless, but I do take it around a lot in my bag. Even in such an awesome bag like that, these dents just magically appeared over time.

Plastic 'cracking' on other laptops? Really? No. DC Jack breaking after a while? I guess if you routinely swing from them. I've got a ton of older model laptops here at work (both the old macbooks and windows-based models). None of them except one have problems with the jack, and that one got knocked off a bench. Needless to say it's got a couple other problems as well now

The one thing I like better on my MBP is the trackpad. I haven't found one as good on a non-apple laptop. That being said, I'm not about to spend a couple hundred extra over comparable (or better) hardware just for an upgraded trackpad.
On both of my previous laptops the DC jack on the board has either gotten lose on the inside or started coming off the board from general use, and seeing how the jacks haven't changed the problem will still occur. None of my laptops (HP, Compaq) were dropped and both had cracked plastic around the hinges for the screen and the plastic where I rested my hands was in horrible shape. Fixing DC jacks is not cheap either. If you do it yourself you void the warranty and if you send it to the manufacturer to get fixed than you're gonna pay quite a bit.

When I used my other laptops I did have to get a mouse because the trackpad was so small, but with my MBP's trackpad I haven't needed a mouse at all, and the battery life is 2 hours longer than the x220, and I can also swap out my battery if need be. I don't think I'd ever buy anything Lenovo after about 70% of my tech schools Lenovo computers had to be fixed due to bad capacitors though.
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Old 05-05-2011, 09:36 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: Microsoft: 'Do the math' before you buy a Mac

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On both of my previous laptops the DC jack on the board has either gotten lose on the inside or started coming off the board from general use, and seeing how the jacks haven't changed the problem will still occur. None of my laptops (HP, Compaq) were dropped and both had cracked plastic around the hinges for the screen and the plastic where I rested my hands was in horrible shape. Fixing DC jacks is not cheap either. If you do it yourself you void the warranty and if you send it to the manufacturer to get fixed than you're gonna pay quite a bit.

When I used my other laptops I did have to get a mouse because the trackpad was so small, but with my MBP's trackpad I haven't needed a mouse at all, and the battery life is 2 hours longer than the x220, and I can also swap out my battery if need be. I don't think I'd ever buy anything Lenovo after about 70% of my tech schools Lenovo computers had to be fixed due to bad capacitors though.
A pair of laptops from the two worst brands on the market hardly make a case for all pc's. Besides at work we have had literal stacks of old laptops come through the office to be wiped before being decommissioned and so far I haven't seen a single one with a bad DC Jack. I think the problem is as likely to be how you are using your laptops as it is the laptops themselves. I have a 4 year old Compaq and it's still 100% crack and scratch free and the DC jack works as well as the day I bought it.

Your laptop has a considerably slower cpu than the x220 and even then it can't beat the battery life of the 9 cell model I have been using for all of the price comparisons. Also that 10 hour figure is what Apple advertises, it's not a real world number like the 8 hour battery life for the 6 cell x220. Plus as I said before a MBP 13 with the exact same Core i5 cpu as the x220 only gets an advertised battery life of 7 hours.

I can swap a x220 battery in 15s, can you really disassemble a MBP and replace the battery in an equivalent amount of time?

As far as hardware failures Apple has had more than their fare share. Heck, the current MBP line has well publicized thermal problems related to the dedicated gpu's.
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Old 05-05-2011, 10:27 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: Microsoft: 'Do the math' before you buy a Mac

Yeah I dunno why apple decided to use screws instead of the old latch method with the new MBPs
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Old 05-06-2011, 01:10 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: Microsoft: 'Do the math' before you buy a Mac

Anybody notice that the comparing Windows based laptops have faster CPUs and less batt life not to mention more RAM? Who are they trying to kid?
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Old 05-06-2011, 01:55 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: Microsoft: 'Do the math' before you buy a Mac

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Yeah I dunno why apple decided to use screws instead of the old latch method with the new MBPs

They did that because by making the battery internal they could have more space for the cells. They also made the cells square rather than cylindrical so that there wasn't as much wasted space.

It's really about opinion. I've had terrible experiences with my previous HP, and Compaq laptops along with the Dell laptops we had at school and my Mom's Toshiba laptop has also had issues too. So far I've had none of the issues with my MBP that I had with the other laptops I've used. As for speed, my MBP boots a lot faster than my desktop computer with an i5 750, faster RAM, and a faster HDD (and I don't have to reinstall Windows every 6 months when Windows really gets bloated). Sure it's slower than other computers when it comes to things like video conversion and whatnot, but IMO that's what desktops are for. I would have bought Windows laptop if I had had better luck with them, but so far I've had terrible luck. Maybe four or five years from now when my current MPB is too old I'll get a Windows laptop if they've got bigger trackpads and have made the DC jack similar/better than the magsafe jack. IMO $1100 isn't a bad price for a solid laptop that hasn't had any issues at all after 9 months of use and will last me at least 4 more years.
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