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Old 06-11-2006, 12:48 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Peltier Cooling, Whats the Catch?

Right, I was researching different cooling solutions and I came across Peltier cooling. Peltier, from what I understand: Electrons speed up or slow down under the influence of contact Potential Difference. In the first case the kinetic energy increases of the electrons, the heat increases, but in the second case, the slowing of electrons causes the temperature to drop. When using n- and p- type Semiconductors, it is possible to slow electrons and speed them up, therefore creating a thermoelectric cooler. (Correct me if i'm wrong!)

This sounds like the way forwards, like having air conditioning, but using electricity instead of R-134a coolant, this means that your processor can be at around 15-25 degrees, and the other side can be alot hotter. But I seem to thinkt he catch is that for a more effective cooler, it is around 225w which mean that there is 225w coming off, whereas the processor is only 90 odd watts (we can only just cope with that!!!)

If anyone can help here, I would love to know, as I may wish to do this in the future!

Thanks in Advance

Ruan
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Old 06-11-2006, 12:57 PM   #2 (permalink)
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The catch is, the peltier will make the CPU below room temperature (I can't remember, but I think it is 26*C difference.) thus you get condensation forming which equals, bye bye CPU/motherboard.

You also need to purchase watercooling and to have a dedicated PSU for it really.

Visit xtremesystems for more info about it. There is very few people who know anything about this here. And I don't believe anyone has tried it.
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Old 06-11-2006, 03:18 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Actually, I remember posting something about a peltier cooling kit a while back. It had a decent price, but I don't remeber which forum or what brand...

OK, I did a quick search. Here's the link:
http://www.techist.com/showthread.ph...hlight=peltier
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Old 06-11-2006, 03:39 PM   #4 (permalink)
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...And look how many replies you got. Not many people know what it is. I only know about it because I wanted to know what the cooling solution in a mini fridge was, which led me to XS.
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Old 06-11-2006, 03:55 PM   #5 (permalink)
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i was gonna do this my self, you really need water cooling on the hot side, and a dedicated psu, the condensation shouldnt be a prob, if you put foam around the psu, just a abit risky ti think, in case it fails, and just burns up the cpu!
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Old 06-11-2006, 04:50 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Well, how does LN2 work, they must get AWFUL condensation at -180 odd! But yes, it needs seperate PSUs, lol I already have 2PSUs to power my machine!

I do like the sound of peltier, just make sure you wrap the processor in foam, almost seems like a good idea to seal it round!

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Old 06-11-2006, 06:01 PM   #7 (permalink)
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yea i was gonna do it, but my cpu dsont need any more cooling, as thats not whats stopping me OC, but i definatley think its worthwhile, if you want extreem cooling
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Old 06-11-2006, 06:46 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
The catch is, the peltier will make the CPU below room temperature (I can't remember, but I think it is 26*C difference.) thus you get condensation forming which equals, bye bye CPU/motherboard.
Kind of.....the difference depends on how cool you keep the hot side, but it's supposed to be something like a delta of 26C between the two sides. "Sub-ambient" is the term for below room temperature.

There are many different sized pelts. Obviously the more powerful ones like that of a 225w pelt will drop temps a lot more than say an 85w pelt.

You are not guaranteed subambient temps. It depends on how cool you keep the hot side of the peltier. Generally this is why you'll see the hot side of a peltier being water cooled to make sure to get those lower temps.

More times than not, the persons idle temps are below 0 but the full load temps will be above 0 but probably still below ambient.

As for the whole condensation thing, it's not bye bye motherboard, because obviously, anyone who's looking into such extreme cooling solutions should be smart enough to look into things like dieletric grease, neoprene, etc..etc.. to prevent condensation.

Overall Peltier cooling is NOT worth it aside from maybe a quick bench. The power requirements for a pelt are tremendous and you'd need a seperate power supply for it. 225w from the +12v line is 18.75a.....go find out what amperage rating your PSU has for the +12v rail then figure in atleast 10+ for the CPU and then you still have hard drives, fans, etc..etc..

That's why you really never see a pelt setup with a single PSU running everything in the computer, but looking at your last couple of posts I see you have a second PSU and are fully aware of it's necessity.


Quote:
I do like the sound of peltier, just make sure you wrap the processor in foam, almost seems like a good idea to seal it round!
You do seal it around. That's the whole point is to seal it off from outside air. That's when condensation forms.

Personally I wouldn't recommend it as it's more of a pain in the butt than anything, but hey, it's up to you.

I was gonna put a pelt on my XP-M last year and hope for 3GHz but I never got around to it.

Sometime this month though, me and a friend should be putting dry ice on an XP-M and go for the 3dmark01 world record
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Old 06-11-2006, 08:59 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I always wonder out of

Phase Change
TEC
Dry Ice
Liquid Nitrogen

Was the best.

my guess is phase change.

or Dry Ice.


Im just to lazy to check it out at XS or google it
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Old 06-11-2006, 09:28 PM   #10 (permalink)
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liquid nitrogen is. That gets to almost -200C

Phase change would depend on what you did....if you did double or triple cascade phase change then naturally it'd be better. Triple cascade hits upwards of -100 to -120C I believe.

TEC's, lowest I've seen it get is like......-40C I think at idle but it shoots up to around 0 at full load if I remember correctly. The only way someone achieved that though was making a dual pelt system at XS using two in line to create those really low temps.

I'm not really sure how low dry ice gets, but it's also below 0, so I think it'd go:

LN2
Phase Change
Dry Ice
TEC
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